Well, I guess the gloves are back on:
Pentagon officials yesterday repudiated the harsh interrogation tactics adopted since the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, specifically forbidding U.S. troops from using forced nudity, hooding, military dogs and waterboarding to elicit information from detainees captured in ongoing wars.
If the same rules apply to naval aviators undergoing SERE training henceforward, they’re going to wonder what all the fuss was about, back in the day, because apart from the barking dogs, they did all that stuff to us.
Now if we can just get the other guys to reciprocate with a firm commitment to stop bludgeoning prisoners with tire irons before beheading them with kitchen knives and mutilating their corpses, we can all link hands and sing “Kumbaya.”
Looking forward to it.
The only words applicable to this that I can think of aren’t printable in this forum, much less ladylike.
All that, and MORE!!
Nose (awaiting moderation)
Appearances are everything.
Wouldn’t want to look barbaric or anything like that, ‘twould never do.
OK, we’ll just get Biblical** on their a$$es from 10,000 feet instead of two.
Nothing sez you care like ordinance. So we’ll push the pickle button.
/but in a “nice” way…
**HELLFIREs and JDAMnation
So are you saying you’ve been waterboarded? Cripes!
As I understand it, waterboarding involves simply stretching a thin cloth over the face and dripping water on it so that it forms a seal so that the person feels like he’s drowning. It’s powerful because it creates an primal panic.
Froggy (back when he posted at Froggy Ruminations) told the story of a SEAL exercise where the play-acting captain on the ship to be “forcibly boarded” during the exercise decided he’d step out of his role. He acted the tough guy smart-ass to show off how he could stand up to the SEALs, wouldn’t answer their questions. Froggy’s team leader had the guy held down on his back, pulled the guys T-shirt over his head and wetted it from a bottle of water. The guy spilled his guts after 5 seconds. He and others have reported it almost never takes longer than 30 seconds before the recipient of waterboarding breaks.
I should have added that (IIRC) the “captain” in the above story was crying and peed his pants within those 30 seconds.
Dang it! Should’ve been “…within those FIVE seconds.”
Shipmates,
Of course, the obvious solution to dealing with all these prisoners is to simply stop taking them….. except for the truly high-value ones, and then we let someone else take them and let us know later what they had to say… knock knock, wink wink, say no more say no more…..
Not that I would condone NOT taking prisoners, but just sayin’… ya know?
This is, however, what comes from having a kindler, gentler, military acadamy syllabus. Time to return to marlinspike seamanship and gunnery practice, ship handling and 3-d tactics. Recruit all the support and Jag officers from the civilian colleges. Graduate only combat-ready line officers from the acadamies.
Respects,
AW1 Tim
“Looking forward to it” … indeed. I want to watch the folks who think this is a good idea try to explain to the victims of a future terrorist attack that ‘we couldn’t get that info out of terrorist-suspect-x because we could only ask him nicely’. How can we not do EVERYTHING in our power to gain info and protect ourselves at home, and our military abroad? ARGghhh!
AW1: well, maybe not for this particular reason…
but i do find your current recommendation to have some significant other advantages in its favor.
I’ll bet they would have used dogs if’n the SOBs at the Springs had a budget for dogfood!
Yeah, I’m still bitter about it.
B2
*bang*
“You, svine — assume ze posheess!!”
-SJS
(Wonder if they made ‘em listen to ‘Boots’)
Got the waterboard not once but twice within 24 hours. Told them everything they wanted to know and started making stuff up… within about 20 seconds. It’s a little bit more than ‘dripping water’over a thin cloth. Think bath towel and garden hose. Even after the water flow stops the towel retains enough water that when you inhale you get at least 50% water. And I had a scab on the end of my nose for a week from the friction burn created by the towel being held firmly to my face. Awful invention. But hey, it obviously works! Who says Naval Aircrewmen are prima donnas?!
If our own military condones something like waterboarding (sheesh) then how can we possibly NOT allow our soldiers and CIA to interrogate these kinds of prisoners in the same way, or worse as needed…
It’s a mystery wrapped in an oxymoron covered in a conundrum (as my dad used to say when utterly perplexed).
I am showing RESPECTS to the Sergeant MAJORITY!
Went to the nice camp held by the P#$%^& Rep*(&^% of N#$%$# America, and they were much too civilized to use water. They used smoke. I passed out in seconds, and on second application, I couldn’t wait to show how cooperative I was.
I dug the “Boots”.. Really! Great poetry. It can be found here: http://quotations.about.com/cs/poemlyrics/a/Boots.htm
Thanks for the info/correction, Chief. The most detailed version I’d heard before was Froggy’s story of improvisation. I should’ve expected it’s more intense when there’s been time to plan.