The private security company Blackwater has been attempting to build a west coast presence here in San Diego for quite some time now. A 2006 attempt to build a rifle range, tactical driving course and helipad in the rural, east county township of Potrero received stiff opposition from locals who objected to the prospect of traffic and noise pollution more than their planning board favored the economic stimulus that the project might bring to the economically disadvantaged area. That board was recalled and Blackwater – faced with increasingly agitated opposition across the county – quietly canceled their plans.
But they didn’t give up the fight entirely – after all, the federal government and US military had presented the contractor with a significant business opportunity. Blackwater sought and was granted permission by the city of San Diego to open a training facility in Otay Mesa, close to the US-Mexico border. That facility was intended to have a shooting range and a tactical mock-up of a ship, the better to train US Navy security forces in small and medium weapons usage and anti-terrorism tactics – growingly important training requirements which our blue water focused forces lack significant resident expertise in.
But that plan met stiff resistance when local activists realized that Southwest Law Enforcement and Raven Development Group were affiliates of the “B-word” company. The mayor suspended the fast track permits the city had issued, promising to block progress on the facility until a full review could be conducted by the San Diego City Council and Planning Commission – a process that could go on essentially forever. Which is I think the point:
Blackwater obtained its permits in March for interior improvements (to a warehouse). The site was zoned for a vocational school, and city staff members decided that Blackwater’s training qualified. The permits were obtained through Southwest Law Enforcement and Raven Development Group, affiliates of Blackwater.
(City attorney Michael) Aguirre’s opinion was that the City Council must approve the use of firearms and that the Planning Commission must determine whether Blackwater’s facility is a vocational school.
Neil said Blackwater’s own analysis shows that the company is entitled to occupy the Otay Mesa facility and that a delay could jeopardize Blackwater’s long-standing contract with the Navy to train sailors in anti-terrorism tactics. A delay also could damage the company’s business reputation and
Will you also be sending this to the Union-Tribune’s LETTERS TO THE EDITOR at “letters@uniontrib.com” ?
PS – Sorry, don’t know what happened up above at comment #1. I regret the error.
From the text above -
“…. the better to train US Navy security forces in small and medium weapons usage and anti-terrorism tactics – growingly important training requirements which our blue water focused forces lack significant resident expertise in.”
But aren’t some or all of those skill sets part of SEAL team training? Those same SOF personnel who have terminated their employment as US military personnel and are now employed by Blackwater and other similiar firms, if I may be so bold?
From a previous discussion we’ve had -
“Like any company, the Navy pays its employees the least it thinks it can get away with commensurate with retaining a properly shaped and skilled work force.”
And not too successfully, it seems.
I know, I’m a pain in the butt. But I’m really trying to be an entertaining pain in the butt. Honestly.
And your point is, Bobble?
Bobble – yes, those skills are what SEALs do. However, they are not in the regular ship’s company duties and skills, and I think that is what this contract is aimed at: training shipboard personnel in AT TTP’s.
Gallowglasses and Warrior Elites
On the Internet today there are several plangent complaints about Blackwater et al, as being mercenaries, as if it were a dirty word. So I Googled “mercenaries” and found “a gracious plenty” of links. Whether you call them mercenaries or gallowglasses or contractors, there is a long tradition of a warrior elite from impoverished countries like Ireland and Highland Scotland who have hired themselves out to fight your wars for you. In addition to a country’s regular military, of course.
Is that so wrong? I’d say we are damned lucky to have them. These gallowglasses, mercenaries and contractors have covered themselves with glory many times over many centuries — like the Scottish Highlanders who held back the French army at the Hougoumont farmhouse during the Battle of Waterloo. They helped to turn the tide of battle in that bloody, costly encounter. In every period of history back to the Middle Ages the skilled warriors of various countries who have only their warlike skills to support themselves with have hired themselves out to help their employers win their wars and protect their citizens.
It gets up my nose bigtime when the radical left’s secret socialists insult brave men who do this to earn a living because that’s the greatest skill they have. The Leftists’ major skill, on the other hand, is to throw stones and run away. Typical.
Marianne
From my recollection (4 years past), ATG did most of the VBSS and Physical Security training the ships recieve, and only during the TSTA phases of pre-deployment training. Their facilities were Pier 13, an old barge, and paint-ball guns. Not adequate for proper training. Fun, sure, but pretty much useless. They need that facility, and the expertise Blackwater can bring to the Sailors receiving the training. While I didn’t know that Otay Mesa had became a slum in the four years since I moved away from SD, It is a close and logical location for the facility, and a good choice.
My question is: How hard will Donna Frye push back on this, or, did you guys finally vote her out of her Council Seat?
I find it extremely troubling that one of our “armed services” does not have the in-house capability for such fundamental and essential arms training.
That the Navy must now outsource small and medium weapons and anti-terrorism tactics training, and must rely on a controversial civilian for-profit corporation for what has historically been fundamentally within their military charter and purview, is just plain sad!
Moreover, that there exists greater expertise outside the military than within in these key areas speaks volumes.
What do you expect from a political climate that adjudicates laws about “under-age bic flicking”, etc? If they can dream liberal ideas they’ll enact ‘em as law! Who’s gonna stop ‘em? Common sense? Hell no.
Did I ever tell you how California was when Ronnie was Gov? Paradise Lost! When San Diego lurched left in ’92 I lurched right and left town. Now my wife (from La Jolla) visits her family but sneaks in over the summer under the guise of being a “Zonie”. Plus, I want my kids to learn how to surf- LOL.
b2
Marianne, as someone who can trace their lineage to the Wild Geese, thanks for sticking up for those who served ‘in ever cause but their own.’
So now can San Diego be known as “formerly a Navy friendly town”? Because since the sailors must now waste their time on ginning up dozens of individual training plans and schedules to train Ships’ Force on weapons proficiency, instead of paying ONE contractor to provide the service for everyone in San Diego, they must now waste their precious training time to operate ships’ equipment and conduct maintenance just to put together their own proficiency organization and program. That’s not being very supportive of lowering the workload on those sailors you claim to support San Diego!
Sailors cost a lot more than Blackwater folks. Not because their salary is so much more than a Blackwater employee. It isn’t. But the overhead required to keep them fed, healthy, paid, HR trained, etc…… is astronomical compared to a civilian contractor. Each sailor cost the government about quadruple what his salary is just to keep him in food, clothes, bullets, health care, and non individualized training and fringe benefits.
So do you want to pay Blackwater half of that cost, or pay your bureaucratic government to do it. Blackwater pays their own insurance, health care and operating expenses out of their contract amount. Lets compare apples to apples please.
Subsunk
I was wondering when someone was going to bring that up, Subsunk. You’re dead on.
Why doesn’t BW explore other venues for it’s SoCal operations? I’m sure there are plenty of other cities in SoCal that would love to have them ( and their money).
The issue is proximity to the fleet: Sandy Eggo.
Subsunk-I’ll bite. I want Sailors training Sailors.
Call me old fashioned but I think it works better that way. As for the personnel costs-well, the money is out there. The government just has to go after it. Plus a Navy with more Sailors is a more flexible Navy-especially in the current climate where Sailors are packed off to do non-Sailor things.
There are some good GM’s and others who could do a good job on shore duty doing what Bloackwater is offering.
Skippy,
The money may be out there, but it won’t be for long. The Obaminator will surrender in Iraq, declare a peace dividend, and cut military spending by 75%. Remember the Clinton/Gore years? Come home from cruise and shrink-wrap you planes for 3 months because we don’t have the money to fly/fix/train?
It’s coming (again).
bah! The best training I got in the Navy was from prior service contractors. All the happy stuff I learned in A school, B school, NACCS, and NAMTRA courses were just prep for the real learning from contractors. No haircuts but lots of salt to share.
I was bummed the Otay thing went on hold. Just thinking about the possibility of some illegals inadvertantly crossing north into that facility had me all giddy!
Oh, Blackeagle, they wouldn’t. Would they? Heh.
Nose,
You are too pessimistic. Obama could not do that even if he wanted to. First-the current crop of service chiefs learned from that era and they will be talking to right wing Congressmen faster than you can say peace dividend.
Second, the current optempo won’t allow it. Plus correct me if I am wrong, Obama has not said that, has he?
Fix the economy, have the stock market go through the roof and people won’t care. Till then the scrutiny will be there and he knows it.
About 2 months ago I found my New Year’s Resolutions for ’08. There in was a long list of don’ts and avoid these, all centering on how not to get your fanny blasted when commenting on Neptunus Lex. There was a three page exposition on how to identify what I considered really, really funny twists, but what others would consider a snark. Dang if I didn’t miss place it again!
If I ever find it, I will have to send it to bobble
As I understand it from the article quoted by Lex in the San Diego Union-Tribune, Blackwater’s Board of Directors rejected my suggestion to re-brand its product “Patriotic Hessian’s for America”, and tried to sneak its product into Otay Mesa under the brand of “Southwest Law Enforcement and Raven Development Group”. When it became apparent that men with guns and live ammo did not quite fit the zoning of “vocational school”, the Mayor of San Diego consulted the City’s Legal Department.
The Legal Department, heavily infiltrated by amoral, shifty eyed, knee jerk liberals rendered the opinion that patriotic men shooting guns to instruct Navy personnel on how to shoot guns did not constitute vocational training.
Incensed that its permit to open a vocational school to teach Navy personnel how to shoot guns was being questioned, Blackwater responded by pointing out its expertise in these matters, and termed the legal opinion “fatally flawed”. Impartial folks such as bobblenoted that this was a brilliant use of English language and a form of subliminal advertising.
By now the cat was out of the bag, it became common knowledge that the so called “Raven Group” was nothing other than Blackwater International. Sensing that Mayor Sander’s of San Diego was courting the well known Hillary block of voters, Mothers with Young Daughters, Blackwater reached back to its military expertise, and mounted a classic “pincer” maneuver.
On the left of this two pronged attack was of course the “poor boy” plea (“…delay also could damage the company’s business reputation”), and thus capturing the far left advocates whose creed is government should do everything for everybody all the time. The right arm of the pincer movement was the irrefutable need for national security.
The national security claim is kind of a bone in Blackwater’s crow. Despite its immense resources, Blackwater had failed to check for flights between San Diego and Seattle, and thus missed a potential lucrative contract. It could have ditched the Navy, and have gone for the badly need security at the Seattle Airport.
To my mind it is unfortunate that nobody consulted Presidential Candidate John McCain or ex-Secretary of the Navy Jim Webb. Although they are at each other’s throats about the educational benefits for those who served honorably, I suspect they would share a common opinion. Briefly, why the #^%&**@ #does the Navy have to hire ex-Navy Seals to train Navy personnel.
With a bow to my old buddy, fliterman, a true snake in the grass, masquerading as a farmer boy, when he actually knew how to ease the main sheet in a puff, I must close echoing Lex last statement: ”I just think its kind of silly”.
#10 Subsunk – You may be on to something. Think of how much more money we could save by turning over to Blackwater – or any other private, for-profit firms – FTSCPAC, Fire Fighting Training, the ASW base, SERE School, etc., or even the Naval Strike Warfare Center in Fallon.
Without Blackwater, it kind of makes me wonder who trained the brown-water Mekong Delta sailors for their 50 cals, 40 and 20mm’s and mortars. Who trained the China Gunboat sailors in weapons memorialized by Steve McQueen in Sand Pebbles? Who trained Stephan Decatur’s men in weapons and tactics in the Barbary war? It was – and would be today – small money well spent I think, compared to today’s exorbitantly expensive ships and aircraft programs – some that might not be commensurately effective, or even relevant to the threat.
NTC boots used to train on the USS Neversail mock-up. No need for Blackwater to go to the expense of building a new mock-up. And there are a few real older ships at 32nd st. – under our flag and not Blackwater’s – that would work quite nicely for training.
Finally, if the Navy can no longer take care of and train their own, I’m told there are some Leathernecks up the road apiece that might have some excellent training facilities already in place, and already manned with extremely qualified training personnel. I’m also told they have some real expertise in this area, and “relevant” experience. And unlike civilians, they operate under the “Oath” and something called the “Chain of Command.”
I seem to remember that T-39 pilots in VT-86 were civilian contractors. I seem to remember that we contracted out our JEST training to Phillipino nationals. Seems to me that around 50% of my instructors at USNA were civilian. And all of those seem to work out pretty well, bang for buck wise.
Why now, all of a sudden, is it unthinkable for such training to be outsourced? Or is it just another politically motivated attack on all things done by this administration?
fliterman,
From one who knows, having been doing it for the last 4 years in San Diego, it is better this way. We don’t have any “friends” up the road amongst the Leathernecks. In this regard we are like sovereign states; both of us have interests and since they own the ranges they have never hesitated to reschedule ranges reserved 6 months in advance in support of pop-up leatherneck training requirements. We used to trailer our boats and MG up there for on the trailer shooting time on the machine gun ranges but they screwed us so many times we quit in disgust and we now send them out to SCI.
You should look very closely at the range requirements for qualifying with M79 and Mk19s and try to work out how to do something that insane on somebody else’s range. Hint: think how you fire grenades and then advance to close the range on the target to fire the next salvo and again. “Walking into an impact area! Are you crazy!”
We have just 6-8 weeks after we mobilize a reserve squadron to get them trained up and through their FEP before we deploy them to assume all waterside security and many landward security fucntions for certain places and things. Our AC squadrons have the same training requirements and the same issues using OPR (other peoples ranges).
We made our own arrangements and we’re mostly happy and we are NOT the ones that have a contract with Blackwater. But if the MESF has great difficulty satisfying its weapons requirements in San Diego you can just imagine what problems face the unwary DDG or CG that needs to push 50 or more people through similar training.
ATG is pretty busy. I know we used them to some extent to support some of our helo assault requirements but their first priority is to support the ships that work for SURFFOR and we don’t.
I’m not sure you’d believe just how rigorous the training requirement is and how much it costs. The old days of stepping out to the fantail and blazing away with a weapon in order to satisfy all training requirements for M2HB, M60, M240 etc are over. We can’t accept that the JMET have been satisfied because the sailor hit water with at least 50% of the rounds fired in such a venue.
NAVAIRFOR has some real issues since they seem to be very very reluctant to break from the old pre-9/11 mindset about handing guns to sailors.
Somewhere around here I have a photo of what happens when sailors are given M2HB. You and Lex’s other 2 readers might find it very interesting and more than a little frightening.
There were recent posts her or at Phibs regarding the material condition of two Aegis ships that make my point. When a USN warship cannot maintain its primary weapon systems; guns, missiles and fire control, what makes you think they can maintain the training standards and material conditions for self defense weapons?
I watched real GM (OK, they were trained in 5″/54 but still real no kidding GMGs who could be reliably expected to take any given M60 and turn it into a bolt operated single shot weapon because none of them could reassemble the weapon properly….EVER even after the voice of DOOM ordered them to check, doublecheck and verify. It was all pointless. OTOH, they didn’t work for me and their subsequent embarrassment was all their own…and the Gunnery Officer’s.
Final note before I open my own blog: Probably 100% of the modeling and simulation or Fleet Synthetic Training is done by contractors and they are a lot cheaper than any other alternative until it comes to battle and you realize that all the computers work fine but the actual launchers, radar directors, etc. have turned to useless mush. hmmmm, probably didn’t make a good point for my argument here. Oh well, you know what I mean.
Curtis – Thank you for a very informed response.
Your points are well taken.
Actually fliter, when I went through advanced SERE around ’90 it had some memorable civlian instructors. Prior service POW’s.
Skippy-san,
Regarding your last comment about how things can’t get worse because even the democrats must accept some realism when it comes to national defense; you dreamer.
War ends and the Army and Marines are faced with recapitalizing the force to the tune of hundreds of billions just for hardware that was used up/expended in the War and you know what the material condition of the Aegis fleet has become based on inspection under the current regime. The USAF has to replace all of its tankers and it probably flew the wings off many of its transports. The P3s are pretty much expended and you know, the Ohio Class are getting a little long in the tooth. Do you think the democrats will allocate even more $ to DoD? I don’t. I can’t even see the Republicans biting the bullet and funding the recap. In the meantime, I do see a return to the Carter days post Vietnam and the Clinton days.
The world will be a darker place but that was the case under Carter and Clinton.
We’ll get to return to pre-WWI era with an unstable Balance of Powers and that only led to sorrow.
#24 blackeagle, and others -
I have no problem with civilian instructors sprinkled throughout a military command, such as some civilian SERE instructors, USNA professors, or VT instructors……… only as long as there is a “Blue-Suiter” in charge of their organization, and it falls and functions within the official Navy chain of command. As long as it is a military service unit with naval officers and men alongside the civilians, and not a for-profit, entirely civilian organization outside the chain.
What is proposed here is something entirely different, entirely civilian, not normal, and potentially problematic.
What a lot of CO2!
While Skippy wants to go back to a Cold War force structure reinforced through a draft to keep everything, including training, “in house”,; other folks who have never had Military training or were minimally trained, perhaps long ago, pontificate on how things should be.
Of course, no politics are involved in the formulation of these opinions, correctamundo? Just what is right for our troops, eh? All those opinions, despite what is cost effective and professional during this time of war, unpopu;ar as it may be, for those that won’t acknowledge it. Certainly uniformed leadership at such a node would be manadatory and emphasized in the contract. If some of y’all haven’t noticed..just about all services are outsourced and have been from the 90′s. Just about every RAG simulator are operated that way as is the food and transportation services of the US Army to name but two..Subsunk discussed overhead and cost very aptly above re the economics but the other by-product is the fact that the troops- be they Sailors or trigger-pullers, are out doing what they were hired to do- fight wars during wartime. Rather than having the comfy shore duty Skippy believes is an entitlement.
Blackwater, the name, is synonymous with “undeserved baggage”, much the same burden as that Dark Star, Halliburton. Perhaps a larger entity like BAH could purchase BW and change the name. LOL.
All this talk. No wonder our globe is warming.
b2
b2, you make me wonder, being a liberal arts major without any chemistry background (in the classroom, that is): is CO2 hot or cold? Does it have a temperature?
Cuz you’re using CO2 instead of “hot air,” which I’ll admit we’re just full of (me, at least), and IIRC, the leading source of CO2 in the environment is bovine flatulence (that’s “cow farts” for you, Snake Eater), and I read somewhere that CO2 is good for trees and such, food for photosynthesis (that’s “green” for you, Snake Eater).
So, given my morning five shots of espresso wore off long ago, I’m not sure what you mean. Are we full of hot air, or good stuff for the environment (that’s “the world” for you, Snakey)?
Yea B2 you caught me-I do want a Cold War force structure and never deviated from that belief. 600 ships baby!
My dealings with conract simulator instructors were both good and bad-there were some really good ones and there were also some “professionally unemployed” guys buying time between flying gigs in the reserves. I’ve also seen guys in Korea who ran the exercise simulations there and were literally being screwed by those “cheaper” contractors. I almost took a job with one. Having been a receipient of their services-I can say that in Korea at least its a wash as to whether the government is getting what it pays for. The parent company is making a lot of money that is for sure.
It would be nice to see the numbers of how the Blackwater thing comes out cheaper. Seems to me that the salaries paid would have to be higher than Sailor salaries, benefits would still have to be paid and there has to be a profit margin somehwhere. Anybody got a representative cost comparison?
Skippy, you just deleted your own post, didn’t you? Couldn’t get there fast enough to read it, dammit.
Zane, Many thanks for the kind thoughts…you are one considerate all around good ole boy, snark-meister wannabe PeckerHead…
must dash off now to rescue a fellow capitalist from the rapacious clutches of the socialist hippy s**t-bags that infest my piece of paradise…I’ll deal with you anon…Best
Zane,
re- “I’m not sure what you mean. Are we full of hot air, or good stuff for the environment (that’s “the world” for you, Snakey)?”
You know moi, I would hate to be judgemental and pick one (IE- good or bad). LOL.
Recommend let sleeping Snakes lie
b2.
OP
I have a number of friends in the City of San Diego’s Law Department. Few, if any, of them qualify as liberals. They are paid, and perform, in the best interests of the city in interpreting the ordinances passed by the City Council. It would be a stretch in Kennesaw, Georgia (where gun ownership is REQUIRED) to call Blackwater’s training facility a “vocational school.”
Just because a lawyer gives you an answer you disagree with does not mean he is giving you a political opinion. That’s for politicians.
Zane … I too am a liberal arts major, but I did take a chemistry course about 60-plus years ago and I remember it. CO2 is a gas not a pollutant, a gas essential to the survival of the planet. Without CO2, you’d be living [if you survived long enough to be born] in a sandbox. Plants require CO2 to survive, and you require plants to survive. Your problem is that you’re listening to Fat Albert and his fan club. And he didn’t pay enough attention to his science courses to get better than a C. His Yale roommate, Tommy Lee Jones, said that in an interview last year.
When all the climate kerfuffle finally dies down, which won’t be any time soon because the carbon traders and other con people are making too much money, you’ll see that the 38,000 climate scientists who don’t agree with Big Al are right, and he is wrong. And this country will have spent an appalling amount of our tax money on a scam. Not that this is anything new.
Marianne [who is feeling cranky today.]
Marianne M…I know it’s late in the game and you’re a bit cranky… but I must nevertheless call you on your comment # 5 above…merceneries, plain and simple, are hired guns. Be they Hessian, Highlander, Hibernian or Montagnard…they sell their bodies and their expertise, much like practioners of the world’s oldest profession, to the highest bidder. They might have been SF or Seal or whatever fighting for Old Glory… but now are nothing more than a fee for service private contractor ( not that there’s anything wrong with that ) … to characterize them otherwise is like putting lipstick on a pig…it changes absolutly nothing… the pig is and always will be, a pig ( not that there’s anything wrong with being a pig ). Best
I love the part about the liberals objecting to BW because of “potentially criminal shootings in Baghdad that left 17 people dead.”
How many people were left dead in the same period from “potentially criminal shootings” in San Diego? Yeah, cut off your nose to spite your face, idiots.
Mr. Snake Eater sir … I realize that I’m only an occasionally cranky civilian, sir, and I don’t always grasp these fine distinctions, but I need to ask you one question. How can a man who has the principles of “duty, honor, country” inculcated in his basic character one week, a hero in short, be mustered out and the next week be only “a hired gun” like practitioners of the oldest profession who “sell their bodies to the highest bidder?”
Did he have a character extraction? Just asking.
Cranky Marianne
What is the problem with having a profit motive? What is the difference between Blackwater (working for a check) and joining the Navy for the “benefits” which the service touts? What’s the difference? The UCMJ? Congressional oversight? Military contractors have that. For every problem in the contractor community you can find the exact same thing in the military community. Sounds like some people don’t like the fact that some are fighting explicitly for the check and their bosses steering business to their companies via political connection. Wasn’t an Air Force General disciplined for contract steering? Allegiance to country? How many times has a military mole (in it for the money) fed classified to an enemy for years before he or she was caught. This sound like so much bullsh*t.
Snake, just above you mentioned saving a capitalist, so I ask, what’s wrong with being a mercenary? Simple supply and demand for a rare skill set.
Many mercenaries, historically, have fought for honor and duty. Some have simply fought for the legions themselves. Some have fought just for the money. Some have fought to get shineys on the chest in order to substantiate a political job later in life.
Call someone wearing a white kepi “a pig with makeup.” Might get a surprise from someone who doesn’t fight for the ‘tri-color’ but for other, deeper reasons.
Richard points out correctly that the “why” is usually never questioned if their wearing a uniform, yet the instant the decide to go private, they’re no better than a street walker. I’m sure the mil-spec folks around here can remember people who did it for the money, did it for the fun or thrill, or even did it to escape a previous life. Some of these contractors actually may not be in it for the money. Maybe they just didn’t like the food, the bosses/officers, or even the regulations on hair length. Hard to paint the motivations of people with a broad brush.
Some of these contractors actually may not be in it for the money. Maybe they just didn’t like the food, the bosses/officers, or even the regulations on hair length. Hard to paint the motivations of people with a broad brush.
And some of them are retirees who found they wanted to go back but no longer meet specs…
It is interesting to note that if you’re a police officer, protecting the homeland and all that, you’re a hero but doing the job for some cash compensation. If you do the same thing without pay or as a volunteer you’re a vigilantee.
I suspect that the profit motive isn’t really the deciding factor here, it’s more about proper command and control. People like to think they’re in charge of whom does what to who for how much.
– Max
Snake, just wanted to make sure that you weren’t left out of the conversation. Hey, I might be back your way very soon to deal with my rapidly depreciating property (but I got a good price & mortgage so I’m probably not upside-down, yet), we can settle it the old fashioned way over some tall cold ones. Then we can go crash an Ahmed Bedier “Islam = Peace” rally somewhere. I’ll let you know.
Zane,
No deleted post on this. I felt more strongly about writing about Regina Ip.
Hey I’m a fee for services private contractor, a/k/a an Attorney and yes a mercenary to some… and as I said above I have no problem with that. As for my simile about the pig…all it means is that no matter how you sugar coat an organization or a person the simple fact remains that they are what they are…in this instance a gun for hire mercenary, e.g. a Hessian, a Highlander, et als, no matter how heroic or covered in glory he is…he still is and always will be a mercenary. I think some of you just might be protesting a bit to much. Best
PS, Zane, Nothing personal I was just having some perverse fun… a few tall ones sound inviting.
PPS, Marianne M, Think kind thoughts and first and formost, and don’t be cranky… also please don’t call me SIR… I’m a civilian I work for a living.
Snake, I thought you were complimenting me back there. Will let you know if the trip comes up.
Skippy, I saw your post in that new comments box on the upper left, but when I got there twas no post to be seen. A little later, there it was again. I think it’s something to do with that edit function Lex added, just a WAG.
I’m a defense contractor and I get paid well. Not to pig standards though, and I’ve NEVER wore lipstick, maybe chapstick.
Snake. Speaking o’Chapstick. Remember Suzy Chapstick? Hubba-hubba.
Confused? I am. Ain’t all civilians merecenaries, sorta? I’m cutting off the CO2 now. I’ve met my carbon quota.
b2