Conspiracy theorists have long pointed to the collapse of the 47-story structure (WTC 7) as key evidence that the U.S. government orchestrated or abetted the 9/11 attacks. No planes struck the building, and the commonly available views of the exterior didn’t show significant damage. Yet, at 5:20 pm, 7 hours after the collapse of the Twin Towers (WTC 1 and 2), WTC 7 rapidly fell in on itself. Since WTC 7 housed Secret Service and CIA offices, conspiracy theorists claimed that the building was destroyed in a controlled demolition in order to obliterate evidence of the U.S. government’s complicity in the terrorist attacks. “It is impossible for a building to fall the way it fell without explosives being involved,” stated actress and TV personality Rosie O’Donnell of ABC’s The View in March 2007. “For the first time in history, steel was melted by fire. It is physically impossible,” she said.
Today’s report confirms that a fire was, indeed, the cause.
I’ve always admired Ms O’Donnell’s determined stupidity. She constantly makes didactic statements about things of which she knows nothing.
In my early days as an editor, I worked for a manufacturing company which made all kinds of specialized castings for such things as the cable saddles for bridges, etc. I spent more than a few hours up on the furnace platforms, watching ‘fire melt steel’ and do a good job of it. I’m sure many of the commenters on this blog have had similar experiences. Good luck trying to influence the Rosie O’Donnells of this world. It’s like trying to wrestle a pig. You’ll lose and the pig enjoys it.
Marianne: Well said, though I’d also venture to say it’s like trying to wrestle a greased pig.
You’ll still lose, and it will be messy in the process. Feeding these kinds of trolls only makes them grow bigger.
I work with someone who, until recently, impressed me with her open mind and interesting life. Earlier this week she completely dispelled my notions that she is a clear-thinking professional, intelligent individual.
She blames the U.S. for 9/11. On the surface she looks so – normal. Conspiracy theorists hide among us, waiting to pounce.
these people make me so angry (trying to keep it G rated). We all watched what happened on 9-11. It happened right in front of us on TV. For some of us it happened literally right in front of us. Why do these morons insist on tellingt us that what we saw with our own two eyes didn’t happen?
It’s sad that for most of them (like Rosie O’donnell) their idiocy appears to be caused by a deep hatred and loathing of our President.
Perhaps if some of today’s celebutards had spent more time in high school studying or taking field trips to manufacturing plants and less time in doughnut shops (in Ms O’Donnell’s case), we’d all be better off.
Rosie O’Donnell is living proof of the theorem that nothing is idiot proof. The Good Lord just supplies a better class of idiots–and she, greasy pig and all, is the best I’ve ever seen in that line of work.
A standard part of the firefighter training curriculum is a warning about the dangers of warehouse structures with exposed steel roof support trusses, especially compared to wooden beams. Many firefighters died before people figured out that while thick wooden beams take hours to burn through, exposed steel will get hot enough to fail in a matter of minutes.
For high-rise buildings, the steel support structure is always (?) insulated. Which just delays the failure, hopefully long enough for the fuel to be exhausted, or suppression systems to work–if they haven’t been compromised by they failure of the building next door, as in this case.
On the subject of tin-foil hats, some MIT students did a study of the effectiveness of tin-foil hats at shielding the frequencies allocated to government satellites. They found that not only did they hats not provide effective shielding, they acted as antennas and increased the strength of the signals that would reach the brain.
Oh, Lordy, I see that I must be the contrarian here.
First let me point out that Rosie O’Donnell is an idiot. No argument there.
But… The whole “fire doesn’t melt steel.” argument drowns in the sloppy imprecision of the participants. The wingnuts are just so hard-nippled excited to beat down the moonbats that they can’t restrain their own ignorance.
First, did the NIST report actually state that any structural steel members melted?
Second, we need to consider context. Define steel. Then define fire. For example, during the discussions of the Twin Towers destruction some people pointed out that steel melts at c. 2750 F, while jet fuel burns between 800-1500 F. Do the math, guys. Given a jet-fuel-only fire, the conflagration won’t melt steel. That’s simple physics.
The sad truth is that steel facing thermal expansion was the culprit, not steel melting.
BTW, Byron: how hot was your torch burning? Was it run off of kerosene and/or burning office furniture?
Yes, Rosie is an idiot. But let’s keep the real world in mind while we’re beating up on her advocates.
Golly, Casey. At the risk of encamping myself within the wingnutosphere, the point of the whole exercise is that Rosie – and other troofers – triumphantly saying that “fire doesn’t melt steel” is a false syllogism. Dudn’t have to melt steel, it only has to (as you point out) sufficiently alter the building’s structural integrity in order to create the conditions for a collapse.
You’ve got to follow the rest of us on the deductive jump to the finish, pard: There was no conspiracy, 9/11 was caused by a bunch of pissed off Muslims. Just like the South Park kids said.
"Sign on, young man, and sail with me. The stature of our homeland is no more than the measure of ourselves. Our job is to keep her free. Our will is to keep the torch of freedom burning for all. To this solemn purpose we call on the young, the brave, the strong, and the free. Heed my call, Come to the sea. Come Sail with me." -- John Paul Jones
"Pardon him, Theodotus; he is a barbarian, and thinks that the customs of his tribe and island are the laws of nature" --George Bernard Shaw, "Caesar and Cleopatra"
"And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."--Friedrich Nietzsche
"A kind Providence has placed in our breasts a hatred of the unjust and cruel, in order that we may preserve ourselves from cruelty and injustice. They who bear cruelty, are accomplices in it. The pretended gentleness which excludes that charitable rancour, produces an indifference which is half an approbation. They never will love where they ought to love, who do not hate where they ought to hate."--Edmund Burke
I’ve always admired Ms O’Donnell’s determined stupidity. She constantly makes didactic statements about things of which she knows nothing.
In my early days as an editor, I worked for a manufacturing company which made all kinds of specialized castings for such things as the cable saddles for bridges, etc. I spent more than a few hours up on the furnace platforms, watching ‘fire melt steel’ and do a good job of it. I’m sure many of the commenters on this blog have had similar experiences. Good luck trying to influence the Rosie O’Donnells of this world. It’s like trying to wrestle a pig. You’ll lose and the pig enjoys it.
Marianne
Marianne: Well said, though I’d also venture to say it’s like trying to wrestle a greased pig.
You’ll still lose, and it will be messy in the process. Feeding these kinds of trolls only makes them grow bigger.
I work with someone who, until recently, impressed me with her open mind and interesting life. Earlier this week she completely dispelled my notions that she is a clear-thinking professional, intelligent individual.
She blames the U.S. for 9/11. On the surface she looks so – normal. Conspiracy theorists hide among us, waiting to pounce.
Ughh,
these people make me so angry (trying to keep it G rated). We all watched what happened on 9-11. It happened right in front of us on TV. For some of us it happened literally right in front of us. Why do these morons insist on tellingt us that what we saw with our own two eyes didn’t happen?
It’s sad that for most of them (like Rosie O’donnell) their idiocy appears to be caused by a deep hatred and loathing of our President.
Jim C
Damn, 37 years as a shipfitter, and I always thought it was the fire on the torch that melted the steel. I shoulda known it was the CIA….
Perhaps if some of today’s celebutards had spent more time in high school studying or taking field trips to manufacturing plants and less time in doughnut shops (in Ms O’Donnell’s case), we’d all be better off.
Rosie O’Donnell is living proof of the theorem that nothing is idiot proof. The Good Lord just supplies a better class of idiots–and she, greasy pig and all, is the best I’ve ever seen in that line of work.
To Rosie The Crucible is just a really bitchin’ play by Arthur miller
I’m sure Rosie is glad that fire can’t melt the tin foil hat she’s wearing either.
A standard part of the firefighter training curriculum is a warning about the dangers of warehouse structures with exposed steel roof support trusses, especially compared to wooden beams. Many firefighters died before people figured out that while thick wooden beams take hours to burn through, exposed steel will get hot enough to fail in a matter of minutes.
For high-rise buildings, the steel support structure is always (?) insulated. Which just delays the failure, hopefully long enough for the fuel to be exhausted, or suppression systems to work–if they haven’t been compromised by they failure of the building next door, as in this case.
On the subject of tin-foil hats, some MIT students did a study of the effectiveness of tin-foil hats at shielding the frequencies allocated to government satellites. They found that not only did they hats not provide effective shielding, they acted as antennas and increased the strength of the signals that would reach the brain.
[...] Found via Neptunus Lex. [...]
“Rosie O’Donnell is living proof of the theorem that nothing is idiot proof. ”
I thought that was sailors
Our city (Charleston) lost 9 firefighters last year in the type of fire that SBW described.
Lou: There’s a huge difference between idiot-proof and sailor-proof:
Idiots are pretty random in their efforts to cause failure.
Sailors work at it.
OhmyGOD…
The South Park boys are incredible. I really need to tivo that show!
Craig,
That’s the best literary reference I’ve seen in a VERY long time.
A most excellent analogy!
You can download that episode from iTunes, if you’re equipped.
AFSister,
Glad you enjoyed it.
Here’s a technical link on the effects of fire on wood versus structural steel. Pretty telling stuff.
http://www.softwood.org/AITC_eVersion/EN/p3.htm
Oh, Lordy, I see that I must be the contrarian here.
First let me point out that Rosie O’Donnell is an idiot. No argument there.
But… The whole “fire doesn’t melt steel.” argument drowns in the sloppy imprecision of the participants. The wingnuts are just so hard-nippled excited to beat down the moonbats that they can’t restrain their own ignorance.
First, did the NIST report actually state that any structural steel members melted?
Second, we need to consider context. Define steel. Then define fire. For example, during the discussions of the Twin Towers destruction some people pointed out that steel melts at c. 2750 F, while jet fuel burns between 800-1500 F. Do the math, guys. Given a jet-fuel-only fire, the conflagration won’t melt steel. That’s simple physics.
The sad truth is that steel facing thermal expansion was the culprit, not steel melting.
BTW, Byron: how hot was your torch burning? Was it run off of kerosene and/or burning office furniture?
Yes, Rosie is an idiot. But let’s keep the real world in mind while we’re beating up on her advocates.
Golly, Casey. At the risk of encamping myself within the wingnutosphere, the point of the whole exercise is that Rosie – and other troofers – triumphantly saying that “fire doesn’t melt steel” is a false syllogism. Dudn’t have to melt steel, it only has to (as you point out) sufficiently alter the building’s structural integrity in order to create the conditions for a collapse.
You’ve got to follow the rest of us on the deductive jump to the finish, pard: There was no conspiracy, 9/11 was caused by a bunch of pissed off Muslims. Just like the South Park kids said.