The LA Times said that the Navy had “multiple opportunities” to end the trials of Captain Richards Phillips of the Maersk Alabama:
The marksmen had moved into position after the White House expanded the authority it had given the world’s most powerful navy against a ragtag foe holding an American hostage. They kept their scopes trained on their Somali targets as prospects for a peaceful resolution seemed to shrivel.
But most of all, they waited as a series of seemingly insignificant moves — from extending the pirates a rope to bringing an injured brigand on-board — improved their odds of success.
“Bringing them in closer gave them a smoother ride,” said a senior U.S. military official, describing internal deliberations on condition of anonymity. “Also, if we had to take kinetic action — as we did in this case — the shot would have greater potential for success.”
Of course, there are other reports coursing through the intertubes, including one that has the ring of authenticity, but being unsourced – which is not a bit surprising – cannot be authoritatively relied upon.
Lex/
Where can I get odds in Vegas?
Next: When do I stop throwing up?
PS: Remind me to call my D0c and have him double-up on the BP meds…
I hear a double Scotch has the same effect and may be more pleasurable (I don’t drink, so I have no first hand knowledge of this).
Having read this and totally agree it true I certainly would appreciate it if someone could authenticate the report.
__________
Having spoken to some SEAL pals here in Virginia Beach yesterday and asking why this thing dragged out for 4 days, I got the following:
1. BHO wouldn’t authorize the DEVGRU/NSWC SEAL teams to the scene for 36 hours going against OSC (on scene commander) recommendation.
2. Once they arrived, BHO imposed restrictions on their ROE that they couldn’t do anything unless the hostage’s life was in “imminent” danger
3. The first time the hostage jumped, the SEALS had the raggies all sighted in, but could not fire due to ROE restriction
4. When the navy RIB came under fire as it approached with supplies, no fire was returned due to ROE restrictions. As the raggies were shooting at the RIB, they were exposed and the SEALS had them all dialed in.
5. BHO specifically denied two rescue plans developed by the Bainbridge CPN and SEAL teams.
6. Bainbridge CPN and SEAL team CDR finally decide they have the OpArea and OSC authority to solely determine risk to hostage. 4 hours later, 3 dead raggies
7. BHO immediately claims credit for his “daring and decisive” behaviour. As usual with him, it’s BS.
So per our last email thread, I’m downgrading Oohbaby’s performace to D-. Only reason it’s not an F is that the hostage survived.
Read the following accurate account.
Philips’ first leap into the warm, dark water of the Indian Ocean hadn’t worked out as well. With the Bainbridge in range and a rescue by his country’s Navy possible, Philips threw himself off of his lifeboat prison, enabling Navy shooters onboard the destroyer a clear shot at his captors — and none was taken.
The guidance from National Command Authority — the president of the United States, Barack Obama — had been clear: a peaceful solution was the only acceptable outcome to this standoff unless the hostage’s life was in clear, extreme danger.
The next day, a small Navy boat approaching the floating raft was fired on by the Somali pirates — and again no fire was returned and no pirates killed. This was again due to the cautious stance assumed by Navy personnel thanks to the combination of a lack of clear guidance from Washington and a mandate from the commander in chief’s staff not to act until Obama, a man with no background of dealing with such issues and no track record of decisiveness, decided that any outcome other than a “peaceful solution” would be acceptable.
After taking fire from the Somali kidnappers again Saturday night, the on scene commander decided he’d had enough.
Keeping his authority to act in the case of a clear and present danger to the hostage’s life and having heard nothing from Washington since yet another request to mount a rescue operation had been denied the day before, the Navy officer — unnamed in all media reports to date — decided the AK47 one captor had leveled at Philips’ back was a threat to the hostage’s life and ordered the NSWC team to take their shots.
Three rounds downrange later, all three brigands became enemy KIA and Philips was safe.
There is upside, downside, and spinside to the series of events over the last week that culminated in yesterday’s dramatic rescue of an American hostage.
Almost immediately following word of the rescue, the Obama administration and its supporters claimed victory against pirates in the Indian Ocean and declared that the dramatic end to the standoff put paid to questions of the inexperienced president’s toughness and decisiveness.
Despite the Obama administration’s (and its sycophants’) attempt to spin yesterday’s success as a result of bold, decisive leadership by the inexperienced president, the reality is nothing of the sort.
What should have been a standoff lasting only hours — as long as it took the USS Bainbridge and its team of NSWC operators to steam to the location — became an embarrassing four day and counting standoff between a ragtag handful of criminals with rifles and a U.S. Navy warship.
“President Obama, we have detected inbound missiles launched from North Korea. What are your orders?”
“I’ll order some more of that yummy St. Louis pizza – and let’s run some polls and focus groups on this alleged missile thingy. If they’re bound for Alaska they might just make things dicey for that governor they have there. Alaska IS part of the US, right?”
Respectfully disagree that this has the “ring of authenticity” to it. Has the ring of internet rumors and heavy bias. Saw the same thing over at airwarriors, but the preface was “having spoken to some SEAL pals here in Virginia Beach…” followed by the same info, verbatim. This whole thing has turned into either an Obama lovefest or an Obama hatefest, both of which are more than a bit annoying.
Is this one of those “in my experience” sort of things?
Although there is one thing that seems a little strange in it, all that talk about the “Bainbridge CPN.” If that’s short for “captain,” it’s a usage I’ve never seen before.
The problem I see is it does have the ring of authenticity. The left has been pretty consistent over the last 40 years in the realm of moral cowardice and riding the coat tales of the valor of our troops, while having none themselves. I strongly suspect the onsite troops made the call knowing they could be called on the carpet for it, but also realizing doing nothing was not an option.
The use of CPN for Captain is a might strange.
I would like to know which of the teams the detail came from. That would be the group to talk to and get the straight skinny.
I get kind of tired of idiots coming around telling us how we have a hate fest going for some left-wingnut idiot who consistently shows little judgment or courage. People who have served have little patience for those who have not served telling us we are just a bunch rubes who just don’t understand. perhaps the above is just a rumor, but it has the ring of truth about the bunch it describes. I’m really not sorry if that is insulting to you. If the leopard changes his spots, let me know.
I’m assuming I’m said “idiot” “coming around telling you how you have a hate fest going.”
All I’m saying is that I instinctively distrust almost anything that begins “Some pals told me this is the REAL story,” especially on the internet, and especially when it is so one-sided. Like I said, I don’t like the way the left has turned it into a big Obama love-fest either.
Perhaps you should put more thought into waht you say on fora like this one. There is always more that comes out, if you wait and are patient.
For example, a commenter on on Theo Spark posted this,
“You need a better source man. There is no Coronado Officer’s Club and no Junior Officer would be caught dead in any existing Officer’s Club anywhere else.
There is the Gator Bar in the BOQ in Coronado but that isn’t much patronized by junior officers either.”
Now, my observation is JOs do patronize O clubs. I certainly saw them in AF and Army O Clubs. I’ve never been in a Navy or Marine O Club, so can’t vouch for it. Lex, I’m sure has been and can speak to it, and I bet JOs go to Navy and Marine O Clubs too.
I’ve never been to Coronado so I can’t say if there is or isn’t and O Club at Coronado. Any one here know anything about it?
While you may not like the Obamanation love fest, the “hate fest” you decry is not mindless. There are very good reasons to distrust the man and the entire lef-wingnut faction he represents. The fact the Republicans were invaded by the Neo-Cons is enough reason to deeply loath the McGovern wing of the Democrat Party. The McGovernites made it impossible for the hawkish wing to remain and the party really became a Trotskyite insane asylum.
Any fellow denizen know if Coronado has an O Club?
Please, Lex and other authorities … Help a civilian understand this. Does the President have the authority to overrule the onsite Naval commander of a particular operation? And how come? Prez is in D.C. onsite commander is, well, onsite. He has the Rules of Engagement to back him up. Doesn’t he? Aren’t they enough? I thought it was a courtesy thing to keep the Prez informed of what’s going down, not a necessity. What am I misunderstanding here?
Marianne
The president has the authority to issue legal orders, and the military the responsibility for obeying them, Marianne. He can change the ROE in whatever way he deems fit, make it more restrictive or less so.
Of course, should he do so, and should some untoward thing occur, he’d bear the responsibility for his decisions. And as I may have mentioned before, each commander has the inherent right and obligation to defend himself, his vessel and any US citizens who do not fall under the law enforcement coverage of a state.
Two observations raise significant doubt for me on the “ring of authenticity” that Lex hears in the insider’s report (quoted here and above in comment #2) about the SEALs and overly cautious ROE imposed by the White House. I hear not the ring of authenticy, but the slither of rumor and a whir of political spin.
(1) The first comment on the post linked by Lex:
I don’t know the secret handshakes of the Navy’s officer’s clubs, nor how sailors comonly refer to the club at Coronado, so I’m an unreliable judge of these remarks. But the commenter surely sounds confident of his ground. Perhaps Lex, or others who have been to the BOQ at Coronado, can weigh in?
(2) According to the LA Times story (also linked by Lex), Phillips jumped overboard on Friday, the day before the SEALs arrived:
These facts directly contradict point 3 of the insider’s report, namely that “The first time the hostage jumped, the SEALS had the raggies all sighted in, but could not fire due to ROE restriction.”
More likely, the SEALs held their fire because they were out of range — hundreds or thousands of miles out of range.
PS: Also, the anonymous report refers to the “first time” Phillips jumped overboard to escape his captors. No other accounts I’ve encountered have claimed that he jumped more than once.
Dean,
I left a note at the other blog in reply to the one you mentioned. There is a possibility that the O-Club mentioned was the I-Bar on North Island NAS. It is used quite a bit by Junior Officers and Senior Officers alike. I still have a mug hanging on the ceiling there…
Marianne,
The joy of better communications is what we might call the 9,000 screw driver. There man instances of DC getting knee deep into something it shouldn’t and providing, a lack of clarity.
In “Not a Good Day to Die,” they mention the interference of fighting in Afghanistan by those in Saudi Arabia. They thought they had the proper situational awareness due to the Predator feed. The analysis provided in that book was they muddied the waters. It is not just POTUS that does this.
Lex and Lt. B … Thanks for the clarifications. From what you both say, it seems to be a case of whether the President is wise enough to let the experts on the scene do what they are trained to do, or if he is inexperienced and wants to make his own impression on the emergency, he can interfere and micromanage from DC.
I guess I’m being tactless. Again.
Marianne
Marianne,
It’s normal for people who believe that they dictate outcomes to believe that they can dictate all outcomes in all circumstances and refuse to let the leaves fall where they may.
Most of us tend to view their lack of attachment to reality as a bit of a problem but as Lex said, if they’re higher up the chain of command you really have 2 choices since we try to ensure that everybody obeys the lawful orders of those in command. Nobody likes guardhouse lawyers in the service and they tend to be weeded out in their first enlistment.
Aren’t Americans great though! One hardly ever hears or reads about a young soldier or sailor confronted with the life or death decision forced to make the determination that his/her orders are unlawful and refuse to obey them. We’ve got some really outstanding people protecting this Republic.
I think the story is BS. Like a lot of other things I’ve seen on the interweb (caption of F-14 flyby, caption of cute sniper, caption of AC-130 hot blond gunner, etc) it is all written by someone who wants to sound authentic. Seals don’t talk about that stuff, and not in an O’Club.
While I don’t doubt that “The Administration” is overstating POTUS’s role, I doubt even a puss like him would restrict ROE to the point where a RHIB being fired on would not be able to return fire. I have never seen or heard of ROE that denies right of self defense when under fire.
Obama is a jackass, no doubt, but as someone said recently (I thought it was Lex) there was no special instructions required in this one – it is the Nav’s responsibility to handle this kind of stuff…
I can think of a perfectly good reason why the RHIB would be prohibited from returning fire: Because Capt. Phillips was still on the lifeboat. It would have been a damn shame to have him killed by the US Navy.
Lex – not to nitpick, but in your opening sentence you call him “Captain Richards”. It should be Phillips.
That said, I would have asked the same questions as Marianne, as carrying on for 4 days just seemed so…wrong.
So for what it’s worth, I’ll finish with a compliment and say thank you for the clarifications.
It’s funny what the picture feels like from the top, and what it feels like on the pointy end. I tried to capture that dichotomy in this “chapter” of Rhythms.
Some of this rings true, what is said at the operator end, and what is heard back at the base days afterward, and relayed at second or third hand. But there’s a solid possibility that should not be discounted that it’s all so much trash, and since it’s not sourceable, I prolly shouldn’t have linked to it.
It’s an order of magnitude better than the horse poop I responded to here in a dKos post written by diarist Macabee. But while part of it sounds true – perhaps because it conforms to my preconceptions – some of it sounds tinny.
That renders the whole of it suspicious, in retrospect.
And there are any number of officer’s clubs on Coronado. Two just at NAS North Island, the Gator Club alluded to above, and summat called “the Main Brace” (I believe) at 32nd Street. All of those fall under the domain of Naval Base Coronado, I believe (I may be mistaken about the 32nd Street complex).
Anyhoo.
Lex-
The problem with this story (among many) isn’t whether or not there’s an actual O’Club at Coronado – it’s whether any SEAL would ever be caught dead hanging out in one. Now, if the “author” had said he heard this while drinking a beer at McP’s I’d be much more inclined to believe him. Everyone knows that’s the only place that SEALs hang out in Coronado, am I right?
I would provide a hyperlink, but can’t quite crack the code on this HTML stuff… here’s the link anyway:
http://www.mcpspub.com/welcome.htm
To quote from their site:
“McP’s is owned and operated
by former Navy SEAL, Greg McPartlin. We are very proud of our military heritage
here in Coronado, so please raise your glass to men and women in uniform you may
occasionally see in here during lunch or dinner. “
MalHarvey/
As a man of the cloth now, I assume you frequent such places of libertine excess strictly on soul-saving forays, n’cest pas?
I hate to contradict a Major, but McPs isn’ the ONLY place they hang out in town. It’s certainly their MAIN hangout, but they are also known to head to Danny’s for Slamburgers.
Lex,
I’m shocked! Shocked! Just 2 O’clubs you write and you failed to list the I-Bar at NASNI.
The Gator Bar is what it is and if you aren’t an inhabitant of the BOQ at NAB you don’t go there. Boring, bad hours.
The Main Brace at 32nd Street was fun enough in the mid-80s to get a start before heading out to PB. It was located by Pier 2 on the “wet” side, not on the dry side or anywhere near the NEX. It’s been decades now so it could be the “main” club at 32nd street is now known as the “Main Brace”. How sad. The main club was where PEB dweebs got together to knock back a few gingerales before heading home.
The USN effectively killed off Officer’s Clubs with their anti-drinking policy. They used cute tricks such as marking the tires of cars parked in the O club parking lot with fluorescent chalk marks and then pulling over all cars so marked at the gate and issuing sobriety tests on the drivers as they drove off base. They also closed down all the JO clubs INCONUS such as the Datum in Newport in favor of the stuffier senior officer clubs. The last of the good ones I went to was Topside in Newport but that was 20 years ago and mostly for lunch while at Department Head School.
When I was young I used to roam to the O’club at NAB Coronado and had to listen to Marine Captain’s cry in their beer over failing to select for regular commissions while we ate Mongolian BBQ. Then there were Breakaway nights at the pathetic O’club across from the NEX at 32nd Street but on the other hand there were great nights at the MCRD O’club….not counting the night the skipper pulled the fire alarm in order to see what would happen next. We tried Miramar once and it was pathetic (this was in the aftermath of top gun the movie)
[All not CAPS, not ONE word]. The Kansas City BBQ was nicer, closer and less stuffed with f-14 backseaters. It burned to the ground last year. C’est domage.
Curtis:
As an AF guy, I didn’t realize the Navy had Jr. O Clubs–AF makes no such distinction. Of course I’m such a fossil I simply can’t relate–no how, no way–to the current PC neo-prohibitionist times that now envelopes all the services. If they had evoked today’s standards in my day 90% of the 1/lts in the AF, Navy and Marines–at least the aircrews–would never have made Capt., let alone advanced up the ranks. LOL. I can laugh now, but it’s really no joking matter and I’m not so sure things have changed for the better. As one ret. Marine Col. told me a few years ago in NO: “Hell, the only way I ever found out what was really going on in the Sq. was at the bar!”
The only Navy Club I ever really knew was the legendary Stone Elephant at DaNang. But that era might as well have taken place in another Galaxy compared to the current “atmosphere.” Mores the pity, as far as I can see.
Main Brace is on 28th Street across from the NEX, on the triangle spit of land between the NEX and what is commonly referred to as the “Dry Side”, (“Wet Side” is where we park them boat thingys).
There is a pretty cool CPO Club near the Air Terminal at NASNI, drew a few off tap there waitning for rides back in the FTG/ATG days.
Never saw any SEALs in any of ‘em.
Did run into a few surfing out at Tourmaline, a bit South of PB Point. Never did discuss tactics… but did have one ogle an old 11’2″ Murphey once, I was glad he didn’t just take it from me!
My view of this whole affair today is that it’s one thing–and very understandable for a President (and many of the “big kids” on down the chain) to micromanage the ROE on a minute-by-minute basis even, in a situation like the Cuban missile crisis pregnant with the possibility of a nuclear exchange–which is why all SOPs for nuclear war are highly centralized and why they took the Davy Crockett bazooka away from Sgts & corporals and the LaCross Jeep-mounted missile away from Capts and Lts.
OTH, modern communications create an illusion of “being there” that is very seductive. My fear is that once we get used to operations involving heavy supervision from above involving all things, and dependent on operating that way, what will happen when comm. is lost due to jamming/tactical attack on comm. nodes?
And as others here today and elsewhere here previously have pointed out, the inevitability of higher command interests with CNN often providing pictures even before prelim. SITREPS are in, this tendency puts even greater emphasis on the immediacy of voice comm.–the most easily jammed, subject to wx (sunspots) etc. A classic example of this was the failure of comm using tropospheric back-scatter (now the fall-back in many cases) in the case of the NORKSs attack on the Pueblo due to wx.
So when I see what looks like confirmation of my fears in this area my ears tend to prick up. Perhaps this rpt was wrong in detail, but perhaps right in it’s core essence. That would still be disturbing…
FAKE BUT ACCURATE. Worked before. Sorta.
SlickRick/
No, I wouldn’t swallow “fake” and call it accurate, but I would look closely at something that was, on balance, correct, despite being wrong about some–or even many– non-essential details that didn’t alter the essential core of the report.
VX
It’s a joke. Sorta.
SR
Whatever happened to opsec?
Even 5th fleet sitting on his duff in Bahrain gave out too much in the first place! IMO, we shouldn’t even know that snipers were involved. Our “imaginations” could have filled in the blanks and had future Pirates guessing big-time about what happened. Some of them read ya know. That’s called opdec, btw. I think.
Sure, it was a big boost to have killed the sea-going skinnies and recovered the CAPT; maybe it’ll help the Navy budget ;-( …..but Geez Louise, it’s not like we’re NOT gonna have to do this again, is it?
b2
B2, I think someone was using their head. The Navy really needs some good press right now, given the upcoming budget blood letting. And I don’t think they were giving anything away by telling us it was the SEALs that did it, we would have arrived at that conclusion somehow. The video of Captain Phillips in his first news conference wearing a USS BAINBRIDGE COs ballcap? Priceless!
I gently beg to differ Byron but I understand your point.
To go one step further- I view this piracy thing as included in “The Long War” and anything tactical we give to this cunning adversary is not priceless. The facts (3 skinies KIA/1 captured
/hostage released) of the recovery speak well for themselves ALONE. The operational details about how- notso. IMO, PAOs and JAGs play too big an influence for simply being advisors/staff officers in ops nowadays.
Anyways amigo…just my $0.02 cents as a retired officer and one who is still interested and involved, albeit on the outside.
b2
b2, Opsec was blown the minute the op was over, because they still had the one pirate alive. Either he gets tried in Africa, where he tells everybody what happened, or he gets tried in the US where the whole story comes out in the trial.
And if you add that item, my reasoning just says the Navy turned damage control into damn good PR…and the Navy really needs the help. Going to be hard for Congress to sell the public on “well, USN does’t need all this stuff” when the USN came out of this action smelling like a rose.
B2 – I agree that JAGoffs and PAOs are given too much play, but who gives them the play?
Fortune favors the bold, selection boards favor the cautious.