In Washington, a gaffe is defined as one of those instances where a politician – typically under pressure – blurts out the truth:
Attorney General Eric Holder told a congressional panel Tuesday that the question of reading Osama bin Laden his Miranda rights is absurd — because he won’t be brought in alive.
“Let’s deal with reality,” Holder said. “You’re talking about a hypothetical that will never occur. The reality is that we will be reading Miranda rights to the corpse of Osama bin Laden. He will never appear in an American courtroom. That’s the reality. … He will be killed by us, or he will be killed by his own people so he’s not captured by us. We know that.
I’m not saying that – for once – I don’t like where the AG’s head is at. I just wish that he’d pay more attention to where his mouth is at.
On account of all that rejecting of the “false the choice between our safety and our ideals”.
Kill a man dead where you find him, but for heaven’s sake don’t place him in any stress positions.
Ah, how refreshing to see how the skillfull Obama team speaks the language of soft power so calmly and cooly, in contrast to the Bushitler-Cheneyburton cowboy rhetoric. Testify, MSM, testify!
“The attorney general said it infuriates him to hear conservative critics complain that terrorists would get too many rights in the court system.
Terrorists in court “have the same rights that Charles Manson would have, any other kind of mass murderer,” the attorney general said. “It doesn’t mean that they’re going to be coddled, it doesn’t mean that they’re going to be treated with kid gloves.”
The comparison to convicted killer Manson angered Rep. John Culberson, R-Texas, who said it showed the Obama administration doesn’t understand the American public’s desire to treat terrorists as wartime enemies, not criminal defendants.
I’m sorry – the AG is wrong. Osama bin Laden and his ilk should NOT have the same rights as Charles Manson. Charles Manson is an American citizen and he is NOT a war criminal. Under the Constitution, war criminals that are not US citizens are NOT afforded the same rights. I’m not sure what Constitution AG Holder is reading but it’s not the right one.
I think the copy of the Constitution that Eric stud/fail Holder is reading, is the Pelosi version. Terrorist soldiers of our enemy are “deemed” to have citizen rights.
They aren’t reading the Constitution. They are making their own rules up as they go along.
If an American citizen murders 3,000 people in one day – then they become a terrorist and should be treated as such. Enemy combatants who have declared war on this country.
What about this don’t Obama and his minions understand? Are they so blinded by their own hatred of this country?
this is as darkly humorous as the statement that KSM would remain in jail, regardless of the outcome of the trial Holder wants to give him in NYC….
they told me if i voted for McLame i’d get a moron in as the AG, and they were right.
You would have gotten one either way.
Actually, they might have more rights as POWs. Could be the root problem is we haven’t identified what these folks are: international [war] criminals – i.e. get a trial in Brussels, POW’s to be returned after the war (could be long sit in a cell for them…) or standard murderers (like Manson) who get a trial here and then a walk to the electric chair.
You would think we’d come up with a means to prosecute terrorists on the international stage by now as it’s the warfare of choice for most of the last 50-60 years (Vietnam, Malaysia, Cuba, Germany, Italy, Colombia…etc). This would be a great thing for the UN to take on – provided the US would allow it.
Well, we could always follow the Iraqi model.
Terrorist commits crime. Terrorist is arrested and tossed in jail. After a while, terrorist is tried.
If terrorist repents of his crime, terrorist is hanged.
If terrorist does not repent, he is tossed back in jail until he repents.
Then he is hanged.
I’d feed him all the Sausage gravy and biscuits he can eat. All the hot ham and cheese sandwiches he can eat. Pork Chops, tenderloin, etc.
Then he’ll really worry about having something to repent about.
…or standard murderers (like Manson) who get a trial here and then a walk to the electric chair.
Except that the appeals process is so lengthy that the people who deserve to see that kind of justice served will die themselves before it ever happens.
Convict the bastards and have them sleep with the fishes.
Where to you get the interpretation that war criminals must be tried in a foreign court? That’s what the military commissions are for. And the military commissions are imposed by our internal law, not by some international obligation. Under the law of war, they are liable to summary execution.
So at what point in the AQ hierarchy do we draw a distinction for “kill em on sight” versus “capture alive to stand trial/tribunal/pardon/Oprah talk show/reality TV series”?
Bill – I vote for the Hanes-Holder undie treatment. Load ‘em up with only about 5 grams of PETN in his shorts and then give him a 30 sec fuse. Talk or talk in a falsetto. Think of all those disappointed virginal raisins.
I don’t think you could make this stuff up if you tried.
So… waterboarding was oh so wrong but open talk about killing is not. This is getting so confusing. Where do I live again?
[...] Neptunus Lex, who’s a lawyer and a fighter pilot, just as long as we don’t put him in any stress positions … [...]
Uh oh… take cover!
A LAWYER? Really? A sea lawyer or a real bar-passing (nope, not that kind Virg) suit wearing, pond scum sucking, weaselly eyed lied-to-his-mother lawyer?
Lex – you’ve been insulted. Offer the man his choice of weapons (as long as they are swords of varying types) and defend your honor.
I have informed the gentleman via private correspondence that he is in error.
I’m sure he meant well. No reason to go all “pistols at dawn.”
Not today, anyway
And so your post seems to be particularly well named.
Although I must say that there are no doubt a few of your pond scum sucking, weaselly eyed loyal readers (they know who they are) who could find themselves a tad offended by some of the comments above. Hey, there could be worse company to keep. Couldn’t there?!
First we get our hopes up, and then change comes around. That hopenchangey stuff is getting a bit noisome.
Guess we’ll have to find our entertainment elsewhere today.
Yeah, I made that mistake once, and Lex was quite gracious with me. Sorry Lex, but that moniker does lend itself to misinterpretation.
Only because they don’t know where it really came from
Kill a man dead where you find him, but for heaven’s sake don’t place him in any stress positions.
Interesting you say that. A good friend of mine (who leans conservative Democrat) advocates just that position. He’s all about capturing them on the battlefield, a quick interrogation, followed by their Geneva Convention approved bullet to the head. It’s the detention without recourse he’s against. He has zero problem with executing them, but does not want them mistreated. In his mind, it’s an Old Yeller situation. They’re too dangerous to live, but that’s no excuse to abuse the poor dumb animal.
I don’t happen to agree with him, and I point out that while the Geneva Convention may allow for the summary execution of illegal combatants, the UCMJ expressly forbids it. His answer is to amend the UCMJ to allow for it. Never confuse “Democrat” with “liberal” in the South.
“Kill a man dead where you find him, but for heaven’s sake don’t place him in any stress positions.”
Sounds like ROI our troops in the field should have.
Would any of you, if you were one of the lucky spec ops guys who ‘take down’ O.B.L., take Holder’s statement to be approval of killing him to keep him from being tried, even if he could be captured or was actually captured? I mean, here’s a guy who would put CIA interrogators on trial for stressing out captured bad guys to get timely information to protect us, yet he’s now implying, strongly, that he would look the other way when OBL is killed out of hand.
Not I.
Convict the bastards and have them sleep with the fishes.
I thought there was a reason I like hanging out with this crowd.
I noticed the plural, bastards, was used in Kris’ statement, which I might interpret as including Holder. In fact, I couldn’t help thinking that we have our own real life version of “Inglorious Basterds” running amuck along the Beltway.
Now that General McChrystal has a unified command under his belt, I wonder if he’ll take General Mattis’ counsel to heart: “Be polite. Be professional. But have a plan to kill everyone you meet.” Apply liberally to Mon Sewer Bin Laden.
Mongo – take it as it pleases you.
Let’s put it this way. You’re an E-6 Special Ops guy who manages to capture Osama Bin Laden. He’s unarmed; he’s “given up”. He’s not “trying to escape”.
Do you put a bullet through Osama’s forehead? Do you trust Eric Holder, Senator Patrick Leahy, and Barack Obama not to have you up on charges for “murdering” an un-armed prisoner? If I were that E-6 I sure as hell woudn’t trust those scum sucking bastards not to do me dirt–if it suited their convenience. I wouldn’t even give Osama a bruised lip–for I’d recall what happened to some other guys.
Nope–Eric “The Dope” Holder is just blowing smoke.
“Resisting arrest” would probably work quite efficiently in bin Laden’s case. Waterboard him just for fun before you dispatch him with a lard coated bullet.
Be sure he knows it’s lard covered before you use it.
I’m a lawyer. Yes, the “pond-scum sucking…” etc., etc.-type.
I’ve said here before and I’ll say it again – We should return them all, in handcuffs, to Afghanistan by delivering them via the backdoor of a C-17 at 35,000 feet without the benefit of a parachute.
After, of course, force-feeding them pork sausage and duct-taping their mouths shut.
Problem solved.
Advokaat, I’m a lawyer as well. And I’ve known a lot of lawyers in my 40 plus year career. And while it may be hard for the “civilian” population to believe,most lawyers are pretty nice guys. Most “civilians” say that their lawyer is a nice guy, but well, the rest of them are bad.
The reality is that most lawyers are pretty straight.
That’s not to say that I haven’t met some real jerks in my practice; in a big city like Los Angeles, there are those w who will cross the line, believing that they’ll never meet their opponent again. It’s a little tougher in a smaller city where everybody in the local bar association either knows, or knows of, every other lawyer’s reputation.
But in 40 years I’ve never met a bigger set of lying scum sucking weasels than Messrs. Holder, Obama and Leahy. When Cheney told Leahy “Go F Yourself”, Leahy more than had it coming. I wouldn’t believe those clowns if they told me the sun would come up in the east tomorrow morning.
When Cheney told Leahy “Go F Yourself”, Leahy more than had it coming.
I’m guessing that was Dick, not Liz, who said that.
Advo and Mike – all due apologies to those of the legal persuasion on the side of “good”. Unfortunately, your brethren in the ACLU and the AG’s office seem to be giving all a generally bad rep. And yes, mine is a good guy, great golfer, fair fisherman, can’t shoot duck worth crap but keeps trying, and can dance like Fred Astaire.
G-man, you’d think with all that ambulance chasing your guy would have learned to pull lead by now..
Ditto all you said.
Like I’ve said elsewhere on this blog – 99% give the other 1% a bad name.
“That’s the reality. … He will be killed by us, or he will be killed by his own people so he’s not captured by us. We know that.”
Can understand why Al Qaeda would want to kill Osama to prevent catastrophic intel loss. America not so much.
I’d bet a dollar to a donut that given the chance a very large percentage of the male population (and maybe a sizable % of the women as well) of our country would take the a shot at bin laden. AND brag about taking him out as well.
Personally, I would rather get him alive first. Squeeze him dry then give him a noodle with the obligatory lard covered bullet.
I fear my fellow Stuyvesantian Eric “Read ‘em their rights” Holder is an ‘effin moron. “Zero” Chance — let’s see what 20th century history says about that, what happened to the Axis fascists?: Hitler– check, swallowed his gun before the Red Army could bag him, Benito M. 50%, he hit the road to Switzerland, but pissed off Italians grabbed him and hung him on meat hooks, Tojo “Bushido-san Ichiban death before dishonor” militarist Japanese strong man, arrested and tried by allied military tribunal, sentenced and hanged. So 50% dead before justice, the rest survived. Eric, not good. If you throw in Goering, Gen. “Tiger of Malaya” Yamashita who was MacArthur’s and the Brit’s top war criminal target, BOTH arrested, tried by military tribunal and hanged well your upto 70% survival rate of top fascist leaders. How ’bout more recent history: 8 years ago US Special Forces bagged Khalid Sheik — Jihadi is me — Mohammed before he could join the 72 virgins by his own hand. Ditto Manuel Noriega, Sadaam Hussein, and on and on. Eric, you are an ‘effin moron, why prove it in testimony before Congress.
*Cough* Uh, point of fact, Goering “cheated death” (that’s what the newspaper headlines said) by committing suicide in his cell via poison pill capsule smuggled in.. The old ex-fighter pilot (WWI) managed to “do it his way” after all..
Thanks Virgil–
Correction, Goering arrested, tried, and offs himself before sentence passed — did they read him his rights? Does this help moronic Eric’s thesis?