Writing in the New York Times, opinionist Roger Cohen pats himself and our president on the back for our successful intervention in Libya:
The intervention has been done right — with the legality of strong United Nations backing, full support from America’s European allies, and quiet arming of the rebels. The Libyan people have been freed from a crazed tyranny. Unlike in Iraq, burdens were shared: America flew the intelligence missions and did the refueling while the French, British, Dutch and others did most of the bombing. Iraq was the wrong prism through which to look at Libya. I’m glad I resisted that temptation. Another cycle has begun.
In the end, I think interventionism is inextricable from the American idea. If the United States retreats into isolationism, it ceases to be itself — a nation dedicated, however much it falls short, to a universalist ideal of freedom.
There are no fixed doctrinal answers — a successful Libyan intervention does not mean one in Syria is feasible — but the idea that the West must at times be prepared to fight for its values against barbarism is the best hope for a 21st century less cruel than the 20th.
Let us leave aside for a moment the, “if it feels good (and Paris gets on board), do it” nature of Cohen’s strategic ambiguity, one that differentiates between Libyan tyranny and the Syrian brand, although this is a very tempting target: If a sitting US president feels free to select his military adventures based upon the whimsies of Europe, but without the consent of Congress, the Republic has entered hitherto unexplored territory.
I will also let slide Cohen’s Francophilic contrast between the Libyan effort (good / ultimate outcome very much in doubt) and the one that deposed Saddam Hussein (bad / resulted in world’s sole Arab democracy). Op-Ed writers are free to endorse or decry overseas military interventions based on the political party of the Commander-in-Chief, military officers (and veterans) ought to maintain an effects-based standard. For the sake of tact, let us also – as Mr. Cohen does – omit reference to the international intervention in Somalia, which resulted in a significant tactical defeat whose effects had monstrous strategic consequences that we are preparing to commemorate in 12 days time.
Instead of his contrasts, let us instead focus on Cohen’s likening of the Libyan campaign to the NATO efforts to protect Bosnians and Kosovars: Bosnia required 60,000 pairs of NATO boots on the ground during the “implementation” stage of peacemaking once the combatants had been bombed and separated. There were 12,000 SFOR troops there until 2004. There are 2,500 NATO forces there today. Meanwhile, over in Kosovo, the the commander of the KFOR forces – whose command was established in 1999 heading 60,000 coalition forces – is requesting additional troops to augment the 6,000 he has on hand today.
Libya’s Transitional National Council is not asking for ground forces to stabilize their impending victory over the Ghaddafi clique; instead they ask for money, arms and air power. We provide that air power even though the threat Ghaddafi’s forces pose to the Libyan people – the explicit purpose of the UN mandate authorizing NATO’s intervention there – is effectively neutralized. There is virtually no chance that any European ground force will emplace itself in Libya even if they were requested. That’s no hit against European manhood, neither have the American people stomach for another fly-speck patch of sand from whence to bury their sons. Thus we must trustfully embrace the Libyan people, and hope that they somehow craft out of the dust of the ancien regime something less wholly awful than that which it replaces.
And here is what we know today about the Libyan people: They were the highest per capita contributors of suicide bombers in Iraq.
I’m no apologist for Colonel Ghaddafi or his thugs: If his head had been cooling on a platter these last 23 years, that would have been for me insufficient justice. But there is a great deal of hope surrounding this latest blossom in the so-called “Arab spring”. And hope, we are continually reminded, is not a strategy. All we know for certain is that we have witnessed the detailed destruction of more or less cooperative governments with intelligence networks that used to provide us pretty useful information about a very dangerous part of the world. We do not yet know what will take their place, and we have next to no direct influence on the course of unfolding events.
With respects to Mr. Cohen, it is rather too soon for self-congratulation.
Didn’t leave much room to comment old hoss. (Or is that just “Hoss”
) And the less I publicly say about my views on Cohen the less I fear a knock on the door from the guys in black suits and sunglasses, so I really don’t know where to go from there. Nice tour d’horizon, tho..
PS: The Superior Being and I were out for early lunch to beat the crowd the other day at our fave local Chinese Restaurant when a black Crown Vic with 2 black spotlights and plain hubs pulls in next to us and two guys in –I swear–black suits w. sunglasses get out to head in also. ME being me, I couldn’t resist, laughingly calling out: “Not TOO inconspicuous, are you guys?” “Wait until the 3rd guy pulls in to join us” came the grinning reply. But kidding aside, iirc in my youth such cars were painted a flat grey so as to be as visually inconspicuous as possible instead of today’s “Black Mariah” effect. Could it be that they WANT people to notice so as to “steer clear?” Inquiring minds..
VX,
It is when they start wearing black leather trench coats and drive around at night that you should begin to worry.
LOL, Edward. Many years ago when my wife was an Assist Dir of Nursing at Tri-County Hosp just outside Louisville in LaGrange Ky (which is a dry county) we attended a Christmas party and, knowing the police check-points were out in force, thru steely resolve, I imbibed no demon rum or any other festive “spirits.” Driving back we hit a check-point and were pulled over due to a “Murphys Law” head-light that had gone out on the route back. As we sat there surrounded by approx 3 cars worth of “your Papers please” cops sniffing the air looking for half a chance, a guy in plain-clothes w. tan trench-coat paced back and forth up & down and around the car just beyond, looking for any other “irregularities.” LOL, all the scene lacked was the leather trench-coats, barbed-wire covered blocking saw-horse and the armored-car w. manned open gun turret parked menacingly off to the side..
Zounds! How I love foggy weekend nights in the fall, with a light drizzle falling, when I stop a car late at night. With the LEDs on the Federal Signal Arjent set for daylight brightmess, the takedowns, and high beams on, and the spots on the mirrors, it always gives me a deep pleasure to walk up to the car, and tell the driver, ” Ihre Papiere, Bitte…..SCHNELL!”
Sorry, I get a little flustered just thinking about it. t’s specially fun on a gravel road, crunch crunch go the boots, as I approach. Man, I love my job!
So it was YOU! I didn’t know you used to be a trooper in Kentucky, Badger!
Nah. You’re the “old” Hoss here. Lex is much too young for that label.
Such things are why you are in moderation so much
The intervention has been done right
We’ll see about that. Neither the bill nor the final result have been established.
with the legality of strong United Nations backing,
The U.N. has not the authority to make anything legal or illegal.
full support from America’s European allies,
Except for the fact that they’ve gutted their defense forces so much that they started to run out of bullets and bombs and gas and planes and started withdrawing their forces
and quiet arming of the rebels.
Quiet? Wasn’t it on the front page of the New York Times?
The Libyan people have been freed from a crazed tyranny.
For how long – until it is replaced with another one?
Unlike in Iraq, burdens were shared:
I seem to recall bodies wrapped in non-American flags being brought back from Iraq.
Iraq was the wrong prism through which to look at Libya. I’m glad I resisted that temptation. Another cycle has begun.
And you think you know where it’s going?
Nicely dissected, Ron, I quite agree.
Interesting – and telling – that Cohen says nothing about the absence of Congressional approval BEFORE hostilities.
I hate these one-world d-bags.
To a guy like him the approval of the UN and Brussels is far more important than the approval of the people who were elected by those paying for all this – paying with not just their money but their sons and daughters and limbs and lives. Congress is only a cover for the agenda – to be invoked if they favor his enterprises and to be bypassed by executive fiat if not.
Yeah but the reality of all this is that I asked my students about this issue and none of them were even aware that we were or have been bombing Libya. At all.
Then to ice the cake one of them blamed it on… George Bush.
DAve;
I think I see someone in strong need of a failing grade.
Paul
Well, yeah PLQ normally I’d agree but these were ADULT students in ADULT scxhool and ask yourself if all your information came from tv news and newspapers how WOULD you know about Libya???
People need to be VERY CLEAR that all the Obama is doing in the middle east is turning everything over to the Muslim Brotherhood. In the name of democracy. These countries have demonstrated I think that they lack the social structures necessary to support a true democracy and sooner than later they’ll all revert to the most powerful thugs in the area, the muslim brotherhood. But it will be and is being sold to the American people as “democratization” so they’re all for it. All the traditional U.S. allies in the region are being deposed in part through the efforts of the U.S. military- for what? Seems like Obama really does think he’s the 13th imam or whatever…
DAve:
If that person is an adult and only listening to the MSM, all the more reason to give a failing grade. Real adults need more situational awareness.
Paul
Reminder of the 60′s Hippy mantra “Down with the Establishment! Down with the Establishment!”
Me: And replace it with what?
Them: “We don’t know. Who cares! Down with the Establishment, man! Down with the Establishment!”
Since then the Hippies have taken over government and they’re back at it, tearing down one establishment after another with nary a thought of who or what will be the replacement.
Ah me, that we could down them. But then, who’s to replace them?
Well, break’s over. Back on my head.
…So is this Cohen’s “Mission Accomplished” moment?
No shite…..it’s like I tell the youngsters, I need to see performance over time…. Anyone can claim something is a success, let’s see what Libya looks like NEXT SPRING when the election cycle is in full swing……that will be ” the rest of the story “
Cohen like most of the left, pontificates because he likes the sound o his own very wise voice. People like him remind me of the sort of people that write job postings. High sounding words that mean almost nothing at all.
The Obummer took us to war without even the fig leaf of an authorization of Military Force. What he did is an impeachable offense. He won’t be impeached, however, because Congress has no moral fiber.
Don’t worry, QM. The House Democrats will decide that this kind of thing is an impeachable offense as soon as President Palin marches us into some hot spot or another with exactly the same level of authorization.
You got to hand it to Cohen et. al. for their consistency in hyping their guy. This fits perfectly with the rest of Obama’s resume before coming to office. To borrow that 80′s cliche: “where’s the beef?”
All that being said, there is a significant operational question.
Iraq required several years of occupation at staggering cost. Libya required the application of airpower and seapower, but very few boots on the ground.
Maybe we need to rethink our approach. Let the locals do the ground fighting, especially COIN, while we provide training, ISR, and air/sea power.
Different situation.
Iran doesn’t border Libya.
None of the countries bordering Libya have any real interest in taking over – they have their own problems.
Any country bordering Iran and its ally Syria are different topics because of that factor…
Mike, you’re missing the question behind the question. For all the debate on whether we made the proper choice, there was an arguable element of national interest with respect to the invasion of Iraq; there is no such element of interest with respect to Libya. In fact -as has been regularly pointed out- Qaddafy had been cooperating with the West the past few years, in contrast to (say) Syria.
Was the Libyan intervention in our national interest, and did it advance our interests? I say no to both, which means an argument about comparative operations is sterile.
I’ll also point out that the invasion of Afghanistan was equally light-weight when it began, and look how that turned out. …Which brings us around the circle back to Lex’s original post.
I’m so sick of this administration and all the folks patting him on the back as well as themselves. I’m at the point when I even hear Obama speak, just the sound of his voice, I can feel the bile rise in my throat I’m so repulsed.
You actually hear his voice? As soon as I see his face on TV, I hit the mute button (or change the channel).
LOL you two, I’m right there with you! My wife will walk into the room and ask why the TV is on mute: Me, looking up, “Oh, Obama was just on, I forgot to change it back.”
When I think of the outcome in Libya–and the hosannahs for The Anointed One, I’m reminded of a Molly Ivins comment.
She had a tongue that would cut through 4 inches of armor plate. She didn’t like Bush Jr. much–called him “Shrub”.
But she said of Shrub. “He was born on third base and thinks he hit a triple.”
Obama hit a ball that snaked through the infield on Libya–and Cohen is going to call it an inside the park home run.
We shall see–he’s still got to run the bases, and who knows what the “catcher” might do between now and December.
I found Molly Ivins to write in a very sophomoric manner. It was like reading a snarky 14 year old’s writing.
Scott, that’s much to charitable. 14 yo bag of venom would be more my take. It was a serious indictment of any paper that printed her douchebaggery.
Agree with you both. And her voice ALWAYS had that tone/air of condescending superiority when talking about lesser mortals like conservatives. Made me want to lunge at the tv with both hands in an attempt to throttle the smug, self-satisfied bitch.
wikipedia complains in the article that it doesn’t comply with their standards because it doesn’t have a neutral point of view.
How do you tell the story where the front of a plane is blown off and the cabin falls 30000 feet over two minutes with a neutral point of view? I guess they should have omitted the parts where they discussed whether the crew and passengers were alive and conscious when they hit the ground.
oh, and don’t show people jumping out of the wtc, it’s not a neutral point of view.
I’d tell Mr. Cohen “Will you still think it was worth it when Islamists are running Libya next year?”, but he’d just say that it’s Bush’s fault.
Could be good news:
http://mypetjawa.mu.nu/archives/209161.php
I hear the chinese have one just like it but early testing reports that an hour after you fly it you want to fly it again
Scott I didn’t say I liked Molly Ivins. She was frequently a silly twit. But she did have that sharp, cutting tongue. And Cohen needs to be reminded that Obama’s “leading from behind” success in Libya may well not be a home run.
We may not have hit a home run. At the very least we know we haven’t popped out. The ball is still over the outfield (pay no attention to the creaking of the metaphor). We may have a home run, we may fly out, time will tell.
I am less concerned about the Muslim Brotherhood. The Arab World creates little wealth. Pretty much everything they have is simply a portion of the West’s resources. The Brotherhood itself can only lay claim to a portion of the resources in the Arab world. We have a much greater ability to influence multiple counties as they transition to whatever is next.
Another thing to remember is that three dictators have been toppled by their people with limited outside assistance. What has happened once can happen again. If the Brotherhood takes over I do not think that the majority will get what they want. We will see more uprisings, many of them in now familiar countries.
Destabilization is easy. So easy even the Iranian’s have been fairly successful at it. (See Lebanon).
It will take 20 years for Libya to stabilize. Without an initial congressional ‘buy-in’ finding funding for 20 years of ‘stabilization operations’ will be a pretty neat magic act. We didn’t manage to find the funding to stabilize Afghanistan and ended up paying a heavy price as a result.
The only ‘cheap’ way to achieve stabilization is to install a brutal thug.(The preferred method for much of the last half of the 20th century)
Greetings:
I don’t know about you guys, but I’m looking forward to being inundated in waves of muslim gratitude. I’ve heard that it’s like a Missouri-Warhol River; a verbal mile wide, an actual inch deep, and flows for about 15 minutes, if at all.
On this evening France24 newscast, they were chewing on the Libyan fat and one of the “experts” mentioned how much the USofA had benefited from its ventures in Iraq, meaning oil-wise. Yeah, right, and please, stay in La Belle France.